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All Roads Lead to Real Estate

A Maryland podcast hosted by Matt Rhine

Full Interview · December 22, 2022 · Ep. 3

Dr. James P. McGee: Inside the Orioles, FBI Profiling & a Remarkable Career

Eight Orioles seasons. A World Series ring. Psychological profiling for the FBI’s Unabomber investigation. Dr. McGee shares the story behind a remarkable career.

Dr. James P. McGee and Matt Rhine at microphones in a separate filmed conversationAudio interview · Full recording

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Still from a separate filmed conversation with Dr. McGee; this 2022 episode is audio.

Psychology · law enforcement · sport

Dr. James P. McGeePsychologist · former Orioles team psychologist

Inside the Interview

  • Matt introduces McGee’s Orioles work and World Series ring before a much wider conversation.
  • How engineering, military service, and psychology shaped his path.
  • His first negotiation exercise at the FBI Academy.
  • What counseling and crisis negotiation can share: listening to the problem first.
  • Why mentors and helping patients remained important throughout his work.

Meet the Guest

Dr. James P. McGee

Dr. James P. McGee’s psychology career took him from Sheppard Pratt to police departments, professional baseball and nationally significant investigations. He was director of psychology and of law-enforcement and forensic services at Sheppard Pratt. He served more than 15 years as chief psychologist for the Baltimore County Police Department and directed psychological-service programs for the Maryland and Delaware state police.

More about Dr. James P. McGee

For eight years, McGee was the Baltimore Orioles’ team psychologist. His contribution to the club’s championship season earned him a World Series ring. His work also included counseling Olympic gold medalists.

McGee contributed psychological profiling to the FBI’s Unabomber investigation; portions of the profile he submitted were used in related search warrants. After Hurricane Katrina, he supported New Orleans police officers coping with the disaster.

In this conversation with Matt Rhine, McGee looks back on his path through engineering, the Marines and psychology; mentors at Sheppard Pratt and Baltimore County Police; and the satisfaction he found in helping patients. He also recounts negotiation training at the FBI Academy.

Historical career source: Congressional Record, October 18, 2005, E2106 ↗

  • 15+ yearsChief psychologist, Baltimore County Police
  • 8 yearsBaltimore Orioles team psychologist
  • World Series ringRecognized for his Orioles contribution

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Dr. James P. McGee and Matt Rhine together in a separate filmed conversation

Separate filmed conversation · 5:25

What hostage negotiation can teach us about buying a home

A separate filmed exchange on emotions, rational decisions, and what people mean when they say “home.”

Watch on official YouTube ↗

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Interview highlights

Three conversations worth your time.

Listen to highlights from the interview in the player above, or read the matching transcript passages.

The Movie That Sent Him Toward the Marines

Dr. McGee recalls childhood inspiration, the Marines and the family that made him feel valued.

Read excerpt →

What Hostage Negotiation and Counseling Share

Dr. McGee explains the common ground between helping couples communicate and negotiating in a crisis.

Read excerpt →

Why People Tell a Stranger Their Life Story

A stranger on a long journey can tell you everything: Dr. McGee and Matt talk about why people open up.

Read excerpt →

From the interview

Questions and answers.

Read the answers in context using the transcript links below.

How did McGee enter FBI negotiation training?

He started as a child psychologist at Sheppard Pratt and later trained at the FBI Academy.

Read at 00:22:09 →

What do marriage counseling and hostage negotiation have in common?

McGee describes identifying a problem, assessing distress in real time, and helping people feel that someone is working with them toward a resolution.

Read at 00:23:47 →

How did engineering influence his psychology work?

He describes engineering studies at Villanova and a clinical-psychology doctorate with a human-factors engineering minor.

Read at 00:06:20 →

More questions

What took him toward the Marines?

A film about Iwo Jima affected him as a child; later, while at Villanova, he chose military service and joined the Marines.

Read at 00:08:12 →
What happened in his first FBI Academy negotiation exercise?

At Hogan’s Alley, the agent playing the hostage-taker surrendered. McGee remembers the trainer’s encouraging response.

Read at 00:22:37 →
What work did he find especially rewarding?

He talks about the satisfaction of helping patients and recalls receiving a letter from a former Sheppard Pratt patient.

Read at 00:28:18 →
Who brought him into Baltimore County Police work?

He credits Chief Neil Behan with hiring him and later names Behan among the people who mentored him.

Read at 00:37:19 →
Which mentors does he remember?

McGee names Chief Neil Behan and Sheppard Pratt’s Dr. Bob Gibson, who took an interest in him when he was an intern.

Read at 00:39:37 →

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